I’ve gone from pro-EU to Eurosceptic in seeing how toothless an entire continent has become to Russo-American corruption and aggression.
If this is true, Musk is a national security risk to NATO and the EU. Consider the fury with which America (conventionally) or China or any regional power would react to a foreign person directly agitating against their own security interests like this while still seeking to profit off their market access.
The US have been controlling Europe since 1945, and NATO is one tool (when France left the integrated command and kicked out US troops in 1966 it was exactly for that reason).
At the moment the US administration is maybe bluster than usual but I don't think there has been a fundamental change in the balance of power or who's really is in charge.
I don't think Musk's behaviour with respect to Starlink is out of the ordinary, either for someone in hos position. It's just that somehow things tend to get more public, or more leaked, nowadays.
This is hyperbole. Europe features full democracies. Its voters have consistently chosen quality of life and convenience over strategic autonomy.
That was a reasonable trade-off then. It’s a bad trade now. Europe, however, seems incapable of institutionally adapting to that, instead continuing to hope the last ten years have been a blip.
> don't think Musk's behaviour with respect to Starlink is out of the ordinary
An American helping the Soviets against Europe during the Cold War would have been jailed or executed. This behavior is absolutely out of the ordinary.
Superficial democracy does not exclude control on key issues at a deeper level.
I think Musk is helping his interests, which is what people in his position have always done and the US is not directly at war, either. In fact so far the US have benefited from the war in Ukraine, indeed at the expense of Europe... but the US look after their interests nothing new or strange.
You're making a lot of claims without a scrap of evidence to support it. In fact rather than support your prior claims you simply elaborate with new ones.
That's a red flag IMO. Are you able to support your fairly extreme claims of secret control rather than voluntary membership? The shallowness of "European Democracy", or an explanation for why Finland, Sweden, and Ukraine would all rush to try and join NATO?
I'm very curious to hear less of your thoughts and see more of your evidence.
Europe features full democracies. Its electorates chose to outsource security. That doesn’t make their democracies superficial or irrevocable.
> the US have benefited from the war in Ukraine, indeed at the expense of Europe
American oil and gas producers have benefited. Americans have not—we’re paying more for everything because of these wars. In the long run, American power has been severely degraded.
Not sure it's the best, but the first idea is for the liberals/democrats to acknowledge their complicity in causing this. What they are offering will not fix things.
I would place myself center-left and a believer in Liberal Democracy, not to be confused with liberals or democrats
re: cahoots, I mean more generally the corporate-government corruption we see everywhere, the 1%
I'm making a throwback sign for the protest this weekend
"Occupy Oligarchy" - something about 1% vs 99%, still ideating
If this is true, Musk is a national security risk to NATO and the EU. Consider the fury with which America (conventionally) or China or any regional power would react to a foreign person directly agitating against their own security interests like this while still seeking to profit off their market access.
At the moment the US administration is maybe bluster than usual but I don't think there has been a fundamental change in the balance of power or who's really is in charge.
I don't think Musk's behaviour with respect to Starlink is out of the ordinary, either for someone in hos position. It's just that somehow things tend to get more public, or more leaked, nowadays.
This is hyperbole. Europe features full democracies. Its voters have consistently chosen quality of life and convenience over strategic autonomy.
That was a reasonable trade-off then. It’s a bad trade now. Europe, however, seems incapable of institutionally adapting to that, instead continuing to hope the last ten years have been a blip.
> don't think Musk's behaviour with respect to Starlink is out of the ordinary
An American helping the Soviets against Europe during the Cold War would have been jailed or executed. This behavior is absolutely out of the ordinary.
I think Musk is helping his interests, which is what people in his position have always done and the US is not directly at war, either. In fact so far the US have benefited from the war in Ukraine, indeed at the expense of Europe... but the US look after their interests nothing new or strange.
That's a red flag IMO. Are you able to support your fairly extreme claims of secret control rather than voluntary membership? The shallowness of "European Democracy", or an explanation for why Finland, Sweden, and Ukraine would all rush to try and join NATO?
I'm very curious to hear less of your thoughts and see more of your evidence.
Europe features full democracies. Its electorates chose to outsource security. That doesn’t make their democracies superficial or irrevocable.
> the US have benefited from the war in Ukraine, indeed at the expense of Europe
American oil and gas producers have benefited. Americans have not—we’re paying more for everything because of these wars. In the long run, American power has been severely degraded.
We seem to be vying for history's best example of what happens when ultimate wealth and power concentrates in one person.
If you haven't seen my recommendation (since we cross paths here frequently and have general alignment), I think you would really like...
What Happened to Liberal Democracy - Daron Acemoglu
The Tyranny of Meritocracy - Michael Sandel
I'm still working my way through them, but they both have amazing analyses of how we got to where we are, and ideas for how we get out of it
With Musk? He’s giving hundreds of millions to cost half of them their jobs.
> ideas for how we get out of it
What’s the best idea out of the lot?
I would place myself center-left and a believer in Liberal Democracy, not to be confused with liberals or democrats
re: cahoots, I mean more generally the corporate-government corruption we see everywhere, the 1%
I'm making a throwback sign for the protest this weekend
"Occupy Oligarchy" - something about 1% vs 99%, still ideating
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50093056
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50093599